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Tune in as the guys talk a little bit about what they’ve been up to, and then they have a discussion on shop safety.
Episode 146 Transcript
This transcript has been lightly edited for readability. Timestamps are retained.
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[0:00] Hello everyone and welcome to the RC Plane Lab podcast. I'm Ron. I'm Tom. And I'm Dave. Hi guys. Hello. How we doing tonight guys? practice. Ron is just full of it this evening. I am. I have nothing. Very quiet. I have nothing to talk about. I'm going to sit back and watch, listen, whatever you guys. Well, you'll be watching. But our listeners will hopefully be listening. Yes. I mean. Yes. That is the goal for people to listen to the goofy things we talk about.
[0:46] The hope, the plan, the dream. Yeah, all of that. So what's new? Well, I've been working on the biplane. I got slow progress, to be honest. That's because there's too many wings. Well, yeah. I wouldn't say there's too many. There's a lot of wings. There's four. What? Four panels. Oh. And each one has its own servo and linkage. So it's kind of like each, yeah, it's kind of like four separate wings. Four, yeah. Too many. One many.
[1:16] But I don't know. I can't really, maybe it's the wings. I don't know. It's just going really slow for some reason. You're savoring it. things i don't know it's just going really slow for some reason you're savoring it maybe that could very well be but i mean like now that i'm home and i'm kind of back in the swing of things i've got like a whole stack of projects waiting for me to finish this one so i can start
[1:35] what i mean the next one i don't know and you're back to work now too yeah kind of sucks it does if i'm honest i really really did enjoy my time off it just went by way too fast always does yeah but but yeah making steady progress on the bike on the biplane hoping and what is the biplane i'm sorry it's a double vision that was made by chip hides company whatever that was i guess it was just called chip hide actually but yeah
[2:07] it's a cool looking pattern kind of a it reminds me of an ultimate the shape it's got a very ultimate ish but long for an ultimate right it's yeah it's very long it seems yeah 50 50 inch 50-inch extensions for the elevator servos. So those are some long extensions. Not 48. No, not 48. 50. Does it call for 50? It calls for 50. They're really common ones. Right. No doubt. I'm not sure that the two extra inches would make or break the model, but yeah.
[2:42] You just have to move your receiver back a little bit. Just have to move the receiver, a little bit of the receiver yeah or the servos i can cut new holes in the side of the fuselage i suppose and move the servos if i had to so what what engine and stuff is this like so this is a 50 cc i don't forget the wingspan but i'm putting a dle 55 ra in it so which increases the length even more because if anything about DLEs and things like that they put the exhaust on the back along
[3:12] with the carburetor so hence the RA rear but rate yeah it's it'll be the biggest if you don't count well i guess see here we go with the the what makes biggest again right it's not necessarily wingspan because there's two of them in that regard the cub takes takes honors at my house anyway in my hangar as the biggest wingspan but this is a physically this airplane takes up a lot of space when it's assembled yeah it's a big boxy yeah yeah so and like you said a
[3:52] long fuselage so it takes up all of my building table yeah so but yeah that's what i've been working on dave nothing nearly that nice i've ended up getting a really a good deal on a foam cardinal of all things oh you mean like a cessna 172 cardinal something like that sure no cardinal oh like like like northern okay like the bird okay yeah it's very, very similar to my Golden Eagle. Not Golden Eagle. Bald Eagle I've got. Yeah, that would be a Jeep. Yeah, right.
[4:31] Actually, that's a cool airplane. I've flown. I've had the pleasure of flying your Bald Eagle. That sounds dirty. That sounds so weird. That sounds awful. I, too, have flown his Bald Eagle. Fly's good, though, actually. They are great flying aircraft. Spectacular. This is the same wing with a slightly different fuselage okay it was on sale super super cheap and we got it for a combat aircraft that i don't care if it comes home or not yes so full contact combat with a cardinal
[4:59] yes that'll be good joe noel so 2024. the only issue i see with that is the front propeller yeah that's a little concerning but it is so hard to hit an airplane the actual odds of hitting someone just period just just hitting an airplane but then to also aim for the nose but i if yeah i know but if it is it is yeah we'll see so dave by the way is now signed up for joan all yep and i got approval for time off from work so we are probably should have done that first
[5:35] oh well yeah oh i haven't done that yet either i i did i better when i got home last year yep i'll get it done not a problem they won't care i hope not they won't okay it's mother's day weekend right it's always like around mother's day yeah i think so i don't remember if it's the first or second day is or first or second weekend is mother's day but yeah yeah i think it's the first so it's not on a drill weekend so i'm not only did I buy one of these things, I bought two. Daniel.
[6:06] Daniel's got two. Yes. That's fun.
[6:17] I got to figure out what I'm doing with the whole spending freeze in the Dale household because of the automotive issues we've been having. Are you going to talk about that or not? Sure. You breached the subject. Yeah. That's the only reason I brought it up. Yeah. So my primary, well, my only vehicle at the time. Went poo-poo? Yeah. So BMW had a better idea to make their timing chain guides out of plastic. And over time, plastic breaks down into smaller pieces of plastic.
[6:45] to smaller pieces of plastic and these plastic pieces trickle their way down into the oil pan and block off the oil pickup screen and starves the engine of oil, which is bad. Oil is like important to an engine. Seems to be. Yeah. But this has been going on for like a long time. Well, apparently. Progressively gotten worse. Apparently, yeah. So the first, looking back now, the first indicator was at Joe Knoll last year when we got that weird drive, well actually
[7:10] I take that back. We got it once on the way to Toledo, right? We were pulling a trailer. I don't remember Toledo. Yeah, we were pulling a trailer, pulling out of a gas station and it did the whole drivetrain malfunction and limp mode shut it off, turn it back on and everything's fine. it did it once then never did it again until joe nall when it did it at joe nall for us and then yeah and then
[7:33] sporadically so only when you're far away right but it did it yeah it had done it at home after that but and the only indication in the in the driver's compartment was a yellow, and this is important to note, a yellow check engine light or a warning light, and then a message on the little display that says, drivetrain malfunction, go check it out at the service place or whatever.
[8:13] Well, what really made me decide to finally have it diagnosed by the BMW techs here in town was I got a red on the way home from your place one night. I got it on the way out here. I forget which. Got a red warning on the light that said low oil pressure or on the dash that said low oil pressure. So that was when I was like, okay, these must be be tied together starting to get serious now i'm gonna get serious i better pay the 150 to have bmw here in town look at it
[8:32] and then yeah when they looked at it of course they are able to hook up their computer and go back and read all the all the previous warnings which were low oil pressure warnings even though the dash didn't tell me that that's what they were. That would have been nice, by the way. Yeah. Who needs oil pressure? Right. And it's important to note. I don't. That when I was getting those error messages, while the engine was warmed up and running, not a weird sound from under the hood.
[9:03] No clicking. No clattering. No clattering. No knocking. No clattering. Nothing. Only at startup, occasionally, would I get the noise. Ron, you said you heard it one night. Yeah. When I left here. That was the only indication that there was anything ever really, truly going wrong. It reminded me of my Audi before it shot the chapper. Yours actually broke the timing chain, I think, didn't it? I think it might have skipped it. Oh, okay. I don't know. Because, see, yeah, I don't know.
[9:29] So, it started making the lifter noise as soon as you started it. Yep, yep. It went away after three seconds, four seconds. Yep, exactly. You're fine. Yep. That's exactly what it was doing here before I parked it. Yeah. No knocking, no sounds coming from the bottom end of the engine at all. usually you can hear a rod knock. I mean, it's usually pretty obvious what that is. I'm not getting that noise.
[9:54] So the hope is that, oh, by the way, BMW here in town, they sent me this really nice video. The technician, they changed the oil while they had it in there, which was nice of them because they had to drain the oil to check it for, metal pieces or plastic. And they also took the oil filter. It's a cartridge on my BMW. It's not like a spin-on filter. It's actually just a cartridge.
[10:24] So they took that out. Yep. And they took that out and spread it apart. And you can actually see the plastic pieces in the folds of the oil filter. So they sent me a cool video. the technician is running down all the things that are wrong with it. Yeah, we noticed you got some oil leaks and it looks like, you got some plastic bits. If you look here and they zoom in on the oil filter, and you can see the little white plastic bits in the oil filter screen material.
[10:49] Yeah, and it looks like, reading back through the computer, it says you've got a few instances of low oil pressure warnings. And so, adding all this together, it looks like it's probably time for a new engine. And that would be our recommendation.
[11:03] Just like he was saying, oh, yeah, you need an oil change. Oh, no, it's, oh, yeah, you need a new engine. And that would be our recommendation. Just like he was saying, oh yeah, you need an oil change. Oh no, it's, oh yeah, you need a new engine and a new turbo also because the turbo is fed by the oil that goes through the engine. Or metal in the oil is bad for the turbo too, just like it is an engine. But the calm and nonchalantness of them saying,
[11:23] yeah, yeah, you need a new engine. No big deal. So when I went to pick the car up, they had a quote for me, an estimate of a new engine, new turbo, and all the labor. $18,000. $18,000 for a brand new engine and turbo and the install. The car is worth about $7,000? Maybe? So… Well, not right now, but… Right, right. So I politely told them, thank you, but no thank you, I can't afford that. Go pound sand? No, I didn't. It's not their fault, right? I mean, it's…
[11:58] It's the engineer's fault. Well, I mean, the car has 130,000 miles on it. Which is nothing, by the way. That should be nothing. So if I fault anybody, it's BMW engineers. Yeah. It's not Isringhausen's fault that it cost $18,000. Well, kind of. I think that quote, honestly, I think that is their, we don't really want to do this job quote. But if you're fool enough to pay us $18,000, it's money. We'll do it. Right, exactly. That was my…
[12:27] But then when I looked online, I kind of did a little sleuthing online. And I guess that's about the going rate because I saw lots of other people with the same issue, weird, that had engine replacement quotes from their dealers. They range from like $14,000 to grand to 21 000 for a new engine in a car that's almost 10 years old now yeah so so what was that one then it's a 14 that is just that is so that is way too new for anything like that and it's german and the german engineers are
[13:02] supposed to be oh german engineers that's so. But anyway, we're not on here to, what's that? No, we're not. You're right. But let me ask you this. Are you sworn off of BMWs now? I'm going to say no. Okay. Yes, they are very expensive to work on. But if you buy a brand new one, which I'll never do because I can't afford a brand new BMW, even their bottom of the line, you'll get that warranty.
[13:29] And if you keep up with the maintenance through the BMW dealership, stuff like this, they will help you out with. And by help you out, I mean BMW somehow, the way I read it online is they will sort of subsidize, if you will, the parts. If you have a BMWmw dealer put them on does that make sense so an eighteen thousand so an eighteen thousand dollar job turns into maybe a ten thousand dollar job which is still ridiculous for the too much price of this or for
[13:56] the value of this car but but i did i like the car like i really like when i it was a nice car it still is nice car i'm just gonna just say, well, what I did, well, let me finish my thought. No, it hasn't turned me off of BMWs or just foreign cars in general because stuff happens, right? Like, I don't know the history of this car before I purchased it. The car had 90,000 miles on it when I bought it.
[14:24] So who knows? they could have skipped oil change i mean you just there's no way to know yeah i still feel like if this car was purchased by someone like me brand new who was religious about maintenance and will take it into the dealer for every little thing this issue may not have happened because maybe the timing chain would have been replaced, and guys, before this happened. Because that is apparently a time change item at 100,000 miles that BMW recommends. I didn't know that.
[14:52] I didn't buy the car brand new, so I didn't get the cool manual and stuff that has all that recommended service in it. Really? Yeah. So anyway, no, I'm not sworn off of them. Like if I get a good deal on one someday down the road, I might buy one. But to be honest, I'm not all that upset about it for two reasons. Number one, I kind of wanted a bigger car anyway, and I got one. Yes. And number two, well, I guess it was really just number one. well, I guess it was really just number one.
[15:29] Well, if I remember right, last we had heard from you, you were going to be buying in 1990, what was it, 94? 94 Suburban. Suburban. Yeah, that didn't pan out. Okay. I ended up not buying it, number one, because it was just too far away. And then I had problems with the BMW, so I couldn't actually drive to go get it. I would have had to fly and whatever. So what I ended up buying was a beater. I call it a beater, but it's a 2010 Chevy Traverse. It's a beater with a heater. Yeah.
[16:01] But it's in good shape. Knock on wood. I'm going to knock on wood without making the noise. So far, in the couple weeks I've owned it, I've not put very much money into it. And I bought it super cheap. And you bought it knowing. Yes, yes, exactly. I've put struts and shocks and a water pump on it so far. And it seems to be pretty solid. And the best part, here's the best part my biggest airplane fits in the back of this thing with room to spare i love how we buy vehicles based on what
[16:36] we can fit airplane-wise inside yeah yeah so i got room to grow just saying it's time like once we recover from putting the BMW back together. Which that's kind of the sad thing. The airplane that you've been talking about is not a big airplane. I mean, it breaks down so small. It does. You don't have to have that huge airplane to transport it. The Bronco. A huge airplane to transport it? Did I say airplane? You don't have to have a huge car to transport a huge airplane. No, you're right.
[17:08] But, yeah, sadly, that is on hold for a while. That Bronco might even fit in the Tesla. It might. Yeah, because the tail, I think, comes off of them, too. The booms come off. The wings break down. Yeah. But, yeah, the plan is to try to make a short story long. The plan is… Exceeded. Yes. Is to, when the spring gets here and we get some decent weather because it's in my son's garage now parked where he will have room to
[17:33] work on it but it's not heated and it's obviously winter time here in illinois so when spring gets here and it warms up the plan is to pull the engine flip it over, pull the pan, check the bearings, and then new timing chain and set or guides and oil pump and load all the galleys. Yep. All that stuff. And then hopefully put it together, drive it for a little while, make sure it's good to go, and then either sell it or
[17:59] we'll decide what to do then. But that's going to be about 5,000 bucks just to do that. We'll decide what to do then. But that's going to be about $5,000 just to do that. A junkyard engine, if we want to put a junkyard engine in it, to buy the engine is about $4,500. And then that's doing nothing else to it, just putting it in. Who knows what that engine is like. Exactly. So you would want to at least have a look at it before you install it. pull the pan. It's a set of gaskets.
[18:23] Exactly. Put a timing set in it. So that's where I would be doing anyway. Yep. So that's where we're at. Yeah, about $5,000 worth of parts and pieces to put it back together. It's Tommy's jet. And then probably three or four weekends worth of work probably. A lot of work. Yeah. Well, if you need help i can watch you can drive by and say oh i thought you'd be done by now okay you can't throw that out without
[18:52] explaining i think we've talked about it okay the roofing job when casey and i were casey's my son my oldest son casey and i were doing the roof on his house and Ron drives by. It's in the middle of summer, it's 110 degrees outside and then we're up on the roof, sweating profusely. Man, it looks hot up there. Man, it looks hot up there. And Ron drives by and doesn't even get out of the car, yells out the window. Oh, look, I thought you guys would be
[19:21] done by now. They were like three rows up on the front of the house. Yeah. And by the look I got, I knew it was time to just roll up the window and leave. Time to go. Okay, see ya. That's what I, thanks. In my defense, I asked if you needed help. I offered to come give you a hand. I was turned down. Yeah, we had it. And so I kept getting, oh yeah, no, we're in good shape. We're doing fine. So I was shocked by it.
[19:46] Here's why I turned all, like it wasn't no, we're in good shape. We're doing fine. So I was shocked. But here's why I turned off. Like, it wasn't just you. Because I'm fat. I know. I would go through the roof. That's not it at all. We didn't have enough tools. We had enough tools to keep the two of us, Casey and I, occupied. I have tools. But that's okay. Well, okay. Compressor, air hose, nailer. I mean, you would have had to have brought all that with you.
[20:07] And I didn't want to… That's fine. I didn't want to put anyone out, to be honest. I appreciate it. I just came by and pissed you off instead. On accident. Completely on accident. So anyway, yeah. You'll be happy to drive by when I'm, elbow deep in the front of my car. Hey, are you done with that yet? Can you go flying yet? What are you doing? So anyway, yeah. Short story long, I have a new airplane transportation vehicle. ATV. Exactly. Wow. Okay. Are you finished?
[20:40] Yeah, that was, I guess, all I wanted to say about that since you made me. Anyway. like is that yeah that was that was i guess all i wanted to say about that since you made me anyway i didn't make you go on for 20 minutes but that's okay i'm sorry it's good so i have done nothing but there was an interesting what's that look for well i wouldn't say nothing i mean the jet is pretty close to being ready since Since our last conversation, I have not done anything. Fair.
[21:10] I did buy a tool, but I will see how that works before I talk about it. Okay. No, it's just whatever. I don't even remember what it's called. The pliers that you twist the wire, the safety wire pliers. Safety wire pliers, yeah. Those are so fun. They are fun. I've never used one, but I bought some of those to do the fuel tank. Anyway, so since I have not done anything, we had, and I usually don't care to talk about Discord stuff on here.
[21:37] I kind of like, keep that separate and all that stuff. But there was an interesting question posed that actually got quite a bit of discussion on it. Got us all thinking. Right. So Steve asked, he said, how would you guys answer this question? And then the question is, I'm guessing it was something somebody asked him anyway, because it's, but anyway. So, in quotes, it's not obvious to me why you can't move a receiver between planes, though.
[22:09] Let me start that over because I read that as through at first. I was like, wait a minute. So, quote, it's not obvious. Well, see, I don't have my glasses on. Would you like to borrow mine? No, because I think I need to pull them closer. So anyway, okay. It's not obvious to me why you can't move a receiver between planes, though, and Google doesn't seem to answer that question. Hmm. And so we started all talking about that back and forth a little bit. Mm-hmm. At first, I was very anti.
[22:49] Just don't be cheap. by multiple receivers and stuff but then it's like why couldn't you there's no reason you can't i agree with dave there's no reason it couldn't be done it's not the most convenient thing to do right but yeah there's no physical reason you can't do it yeah and I think a lot of it depends on the airplane also. Like taking a six-channel receiver, let's say, and moving it from a three-channel park flyer to a six-channel complex aircraft.
[23:18] I mean, really, honestly, if the airplane is set up correctly, there's really no reason you couldn't do that. And for most of the airplanes that aren't bind and fly, so like you're talking just any other airplane that doesn't have settings stored in it, all the settings and stuff are stored on your radio. Normally, yeah. So trims, all that kind of stuff are going to be on your radio. So your receiver is just a dumb piece of
[23:41] equipment inside that just listens. Yeah. Just bind it and do a pre-flight, make sure you plugged everything in the right hole, and you're good. You wouldn't even have to bind it. You're already bound to it, right? Well, the initial time that you move it over. Oh, yeah. Right. Well, no, you wouldn't even have to do that. No, I see what Ron's saying. The settings would change. Why? You would change? If this is an airplane that you've flown oh i see oh yeah
[24:07] the times would change yes wow that's loud your trims would change yeah your flap settings when all those things you set yeah would be different yeah so you would have to rebind it because all that stuff is saved per bind per airplane so it's saved per airplane file on the transmitter so you yeah but like it so if you wanted so you're saying you would fly every single airplane on the same profile is what you're getting no like if you change profiles you will
[24:38] have to rebind i gotcha i didn't think that went through all the way but yeah you're right yeah so but even so it's not that big a deal. Like if everything is set up from the last flight correctly in your transmitter and you bind that and you pull that receiver out, bind it to something else, and then when you bring that receiver back to that airplane and bind it to that airplane, it binds it with those old settings. So it should be fine.
[25:02] Like Dave said, it's not the most convenient thing to do, should be fine. Like Dave said, it's not the most convenient thing to do, but if you're on a budget or you just don't feel like owning 40 plus receivers, like some of us, I'm looking at Dave, then yeah, it can be done. Sure. At least with Spectrum. Now I don't know how Futaba and the rest of them do, because I only know, I only speak Spectrum. Yeah, same here.
[25:28] But that was one of those things, like I said, my original thought was just get a new one. Why would you even think about it or worry about it? Some of the responses came in, and I was like, what? There actually is no real reason other than me being lazy, I guess. Just convenience. Yeah. Convenience. To not worry about doing that. Yeah. Now, other than the obvious problems, I mean, obviously you can't fly a six-channel airplane with a four-channel receiver, right?
[25:51] No, but if you go bigger on your receiver. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, swapping an eight-channel receiver between 18 different airplanes that are eight channels or less. Oh, eight channels or less? You're good. Yeah, it can totally be done. It may not be the most, well, definitely economical, but not the most convenient way of doing things. Especially if you fly like we do. We generally take more than a couple airplanes to the field.
[26:12] So that could be kind of inconvenient, but absolutely can be done. I've got one airplane that I fly every five years. No reason to have a receiver sitting around in it all the time. And it doesn't cost you anything to have that model saved in your memory of your transmitter. Right. So, yeah. That makes sense. Like, actually, that's probably smarter than buying a receiver to just sit idle for five years so you can fly it once. That doesn't make a lot of sense, financially speaking. Right.
[26:41] So, maybe more airplanes. Well. If you don't have a receiver per. But, I i mean like i said haven't thought about it and going through i probably will still just i like the idea of having the airplane ready to go all i gotta do is put a battery in it charge it put fuel in whatever it is as opposed to going about it the long way of changing things over but yeah i don't have as many airplanes as as most
[27:06] most everyone else like i generally speaking i i if i'm not that's true flying an airplane i i pull the stuff out of it and fly something else with it generally speaking but i have most of the airplanes that i fly with any sort of regularity meaning once at least in two or three years they have their own receivers okay my gws a10 doesn't have a receiver in it i fly it once or twice a year yeah i just go find
[27:33] another airplane that i haven't flown for a while yank the receiver out of it move it over that's that's funny because mine that has never been flown before and hasn't been touched for two years you still need to work on it yes and sand is's the last time they've worked on it i think it has a receiver in it already yeah no i mean i have airplanes with receivers in them that i haven't flown for i can't well at least since 20
[27:57] when did when did i fly all my airplanes was that 2021 or was that wasn't last year was it maybe it was last year it was it was last it was last year. It was last year. I guess there's lots of planes I haven't flown since then. Well, this was a bad year for you. And it's okay. Next year will be better. At any rate, it can absolutely be done. Like I said, that thought had… I mean, it's something I'd heard people talking about before,
[28:23] and it's like, I didn't understand why you would do that. But now it kind of makes sense, depending on what airplane you're flying. Back when I was a poor college student, that's exactly what I did. Yeah, we just moved radio gear around all the time. All the time, yeah. Moved servos around. Receivers, batteries, oh, yeah. That's funny. Yeah, as a poor college student, I did that quite often.
[28:44] I think I had two or three airplanes that would be constantly swapping them yeah but that's back when we wrapped them in foam and rubber banded them in the airplane it wasn't too big a deal weren't like glued into the airplane with double-sided tape or my receiver is like 60 bucks and 80s money so yeah yeah well they're expensive now. Yeah. Yeah. We were talking about that before the show. I need a 9-channel or better for this biplane. And I don't think they make 9-channel anymore.
[29:12] So it's either 10. It's a 10, $120 that I don't have. That'll be all right. I'll make do. It's worth it. I'm hoping to have it ready by January 1st. I have a lemon receiver you could put in there. No, thank you. Just let me be clear. Thanks. But no thanks. But no. Yeah. The fuel in the tank is worth more than the receiver. No, that might be true. Like I said, I bought that, I think I bought it at Toledo last year, right? I think it was $11. Yeah, it wasn't much at all.
[29:43] The tank of fuel is more than the receiver it's definitely not anything that's going to go in something expensive but some piece of foam or something like that i would have no problem trying like maybe a foam jet maybe oh yeah i don't even know about that oh yeah well then what is the point of having a 10 channel lemon receiver then i mean honestly no matter how much it costs i don't know i didn't think it through i just saw it i was like huh cheap let's go ahead and just put that.
[30:05] I won't even put that in the cardinal. Maybe. No offense to the fruit people, but no. I don't think I would. Yeah, I got nothing. I don't know what I would put it in. Yep. Me either. Oh, well. So there you go. $11 well spent. Oh, well. So there you go. $11 well spent. Is that all we were going to talk about before we get into our main Tom Dale topic? I think so. I think that was it. Okay. Because I don't have any notes today. I know. I got all the notes today.
[30:39] This is all Tom. So I came prepared today. I love how he acts like I never do. He's like, well, I am prepared. I actually put a little bit of thought into today's episode. And what prompted me to think about what we're getting ready to talk about was I was working on the biplane. And I posted a picture on Discord. I put a puncture in the bottom of my brand new airplane with my steel rule in it, aggravated me. And then while I was aggravated, my exacto knife rolled off the table
[31:05] and guess where it stuck me? Right in the top of the foot. So I was done working on the airplane for the night, but that got me thinking about, workshop safety. it's ironic about that though. When you were over working on the jet with me, we have the conversation about, about what? Safety. Well, but how you don't like my X-Acto knives because they don't have the square edge on them and they roll. They roll
[31:33] easily. So what were you using? Well, I was using my X-Acto knife, but I must've bumped it or, oh, I think I actually drug it off the table by, because I was in a hurry and I wasn't taking my time. And I was cutting a piece of light ply from my fuel tank tray. And as I pulled that off the table, the knife came with it and right into my foot. Ouch. Yeah. Oh. Luckily, it didn't go deep. I was going to say, are you okay? Yeah, I'm fine. It just made me mad more than anything. Yeah.
[32:02] I had one roll off a counter years ago on me and landed in my thigh standing straight up and it's going, and it's like, okay, this kind of hurts. But then I got thinking, I'm going to pull that out. Yeah. That's not, that's not really funny. Like that kind of makes me, well, I'm laughing. I think it's funny. Oh, I don't do well. Yeah. So I thought anti-roll things or put zip ties on them ever since. Oh, that's actually a really good idea. I like that.
[32:28] At least you get a second when you hear them going clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk. Yeah, what's coming, so you jump out of the way. So, yeah, workshop safety. It's something that nobody likes to talk about. Safety third, right? Nobody likes to talk about safety, but I think there are some valuable lessons to be learned from us old timers because we've seen it and done it all and been injured by most of it,
[32:51] at least once. Yeah, we try to kill ourselves in multiple ways. Multiple different ways. So, yeah, there's some things you can do in the workshop to help prevent injury to yourself and more importantly to your airplanes. dave you mentioned it i'll start with the exacto knives they're hazardous in many different ways like rolling off of the table into your foot or your thigh if you're wearing shorts which i'm guilty of don't wear
[33:17] shorts in the workshop really well yeah everything goes right on your legs if you're sitting and you're working like with stuff stuff right above your lap. Yeah, blistered inside of my thigh with iron. Iron, CA. When it dries instantly, it creates a lot of heat and those little burn marks. Yeah. I guess I stand for most of the time when I work on things. Well, you wear pants most of the time. I don't see you in shorts normally. When I'm by myself, I work nude.
[33:45] Gross. I'm kidding myself, I work nude. Gross. I'm kidding, by the way. But Dave, you mentioned those doodads we could buy to put, I think General Silicone's made them. Yeah, there's a couple places that sell those. There were little triangular things that you'd slide over the handle so that they just would not roll. I could never get used to working with them because they were kind of cumbersome. I like the Excel that's got the hex built into the end of it. Those are the ones I use.
[34:07] Yeah. And that does a pretty good job of… The Excel what? The actual… The Excel handles. Handles. Mm-hmm. And then the zip tie. You can run a zip tie around it. Yeah, that's a good idea, too. I've got an Excel with a zip tie because I broke my… Yeah. But really more like…
[34:24] So, yeah, there's things you can do to your, have a place where you always keep it, right? So where it's at. So when you're dragging stuff on the workbench, you're not dragging it off onto your lap or your foot or whatever. Like if you can, if you keep your workshop somewhat picked up and you have a space for everything and where that space is that you tend to stay away from that space if that makes sense I always make
[34:48] sure my blades are pointing away from me when I put it that's that's that was this motion I was making over here you have it pointing away from you preferably away from the work area that you're working in too so how many exacto knives do you guys have and use normally Normally when I'm working, I have one. My workbench, I've got two. And I work with multiple levels of dullness. Yeah. So I got one that's got an eh blade on it, and I got one with a fresh blade in it.
[35:15] And then I will, as the one that gets too dull, swap them out. So then the sharp blade becomes the dull one. Yeah. I just do one. I keep one on the workbench for when I'm working on stuff on the bench, and then I keep one in my flight box. So because I'm unorganized, I usually have about four. Oh, my God. How do you keep track of it? How do where they're at? Well, I don't. See? Because there's usually only one where I know where it is. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
[35:45] Because that's usually only one where I know where it is. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So speaking of kind of trying to keep organized, if you go on Thingiverse, because I have the pegboard in front of my workbench. Yeah. If you go on Thingiverse, I found X-Acto knife holders that you can print for the pegboard stuff, and they're awesome. I have two of them. That's why I know I have four. Nice. Something else I do with the razor but for the exacto blade
[36:10] the color of the handle If you look at my bench most of mine are pink whenever I can find them. Hmm because the pink sticks out Yeah, my black one. I keep out the field because I can't lose my day on my workbench. Yeah, I Would not be able to keep track of four X-Acto knives. I just… Well, that's my point. Like, I'm very unorganized, so I can't. Okay. Yeah. Sorry. I mean, that's… But technique also, right? So, like, a lot of people…
[36:40] Like, I have to learn lessons the hard way, it seems like. And I've learned many lessons and if you look at my fingers you'll be able to tell that i've learned a lot of lessons with exacto knives exacto knives not table saws ron oh i have all my fingers they're just all scarred and stuff it's a low blow well you're the you started you gave me the fingers, whatever you want to wave, whatever. Anyway, technique, never cut towards yourself, right? Like I'm guilty of it.
[37:12] you've got this piece of ply or whatever, and for whatever reason you don't want to slice away from it, you're coming at yourself. And yeah, I've stabbed myself before. I'm not proud of it. It's not something I'm proud of, but it's a lesson learned the hard way. not something I'm proud of, but it's a lesson learned the hard way. But if you can, try to arrange your work such that you're cutting away from your body. Multiple light cuts. Don't press.
[37:34] Yeah, right. Yep. Don't try to take it all off with one cut. I'm talking about light ply, specifically, if you cut your light ply with an X-Acto, which I do because I'm too lazy to walk out to the garage to the bandsaw. i'm literally too lazy to roll to the other side of the room but light ply can be cut with an exacto knife with several passes don't try to do it in one pass because what's going to happen you're going to be pressing down so hard something's going to
[38:00] slip and then where's that knife going to go because you're pulling it towards you it's going to go right into your gut and that is not or the broken piece is gonna go flying into your face there's that also i've taken a tip out of my cheek ouch yeah i don't think i like this topic yeah yeah and like cutting covering like i'm guilty of like i've done this like i can't tell you how many times I've done this.
[38:25] Cutting a long piece of covering, I've got my big three-foot-long steel straight edge on there, and I've got it all lined up, and I set the knife against the straight edge, and I whoosh. Right over your fingertip. Yep, there goes the tip of my finger. Yeah, I've done that several times. Just look, it takes a second. Look before you cut. Make sure your fingers aren't hanging over the edge of the straight edge so that you don't cut them off. I do this. You get the claw going.
[38:52] Yeah. I'm guilty. Like, I just, I think, what's the last airplane? Oh, the Duelist would be the last airplane I think I did a full cover on. And yeah, I'm pretty sure I sliced a tip off of one of my fingers when I was doing that. So just, yeah, take a second, slow down, don't get in a hurry. Think about where that blade's going to end up in five seconds. Exactly. Look before you cut. Yeah. I mean, these are things that I feel like I shouldn't have to say, but since they happened to me,
[39:20] I'm sure there's someone else out there that it probably has happened to as well. So when you cut covering with an X-Acto knife, what do you cut it on? I cut it on my foam board. Just a piece of foam? Mm-hmm. Yep. Cut mat? Or a cut mat, yep. So most of the long cuts for covering, I can't do it on the cut mat because it's not big enough. So I usually use the off cut of the big giant piece of foam board that i used to line my table does that make sense yeah if i don't have
[39:51] the steel on mine for the magnetic building board i'll i've got carpet oh that's good those carpet squares and you're cutting very lightly through the covering so you shouldn't really right slice up your carpet squares yeah but if you do i mean a couple bucks pry them off put a new one on yeah the foam does i noticed it does dull the blade pretty quickly yeah i've noticed that yeah the carpet does too oh does it okay well but the cut mats are probably
[40:16] fairly easy on the blades yeah cut mat's not too bad but it's only 18 inches so yeah right it just seems like that. I don't know. Even the self-healing ones don't work all that great for me. I just don't like them very much. Yeah, they still get lines in them, which can draw your blade off, too. Yeah. Speaking of blades, don't use the X-Acto blade as a prying tool. Not a crowbar. I mean… They're not very strong. So all the stuff I'm talking about are the stupid things I've done, okay?
[40:50] Like, I'm not judging people because I've done everything that we're going to talk about here, but trying to pry a cured glue blob on the surface of your airplane with an X-Acto blade is not a smart move. Because what's going to happen is one of two things. Either the blob is going to cut loose unexpectedly and end up right in your face, or worse, the blade is going to break, and then those shards of metal are going to go flying through the air towards your face, and that's no bueno.
[41:22] Yeah. Yeah. So don't use your X-Acto knife blade to pry things what do you do with your old blades so me personally i when i'm i'm like i'm in a hurry like all the time like that's just that's just a bad character trait of mine like i'm always in a hurry. I always want to get stuff done in a hurry.
[41:51] So what I do is I take the old blade out. I go into my other, like I have kind of two work areas now. Thanks, Lori. I have my original shop, which is in the kind of the darkest part of the basement. And then I have the area where I sort of took over when our middle kid moved out. So I'll take the dull blade, walk into my old shop, and stick that in my old building board, which is a big chunk of foam on top of a hollow core door, and then I'll put a new blade in and go do what I do.
[42:14] And then when there's enough of them on there, stuck in that board where I can't, like, function on that part of the board anymore, I take an old servo case, and I put them in there and snap it shut and i'm not even close to filling that thing yet i mean it's been years so yeah and when they're full i'm not exactly sure what i'll do with them recycle them hopefully somewhere but i don't know
[42:37] what what do you do with them after you i use an old soda bottle. Okay. Same idea. Yeah. Some sort of a container to contain them. But as soon as I'm done, though, that's when I put it in there. Oh, okay. I don't leave it out. Well, I mean, they're not left out. They're stuck in the foam board, so I know they're not going to go anywhere. No, but they're still out. They're out. I mean, they're not contained. No, that's true. contain. No, that's true.
[43:03] Right now, there's probably conservatively speaking, 12 used blades just sort of stuck into the corner of that board. That's not too bad. I mean, that's like one covering job. Right. I mean, really. That's true. But I guess that's a good question, though. Like, when I finally get that servo case full of blades to where I can't put any more in there, what do I do with it then? Get a bigger case. Okay. I mean, just, it would take 20 years to fill up a two-liter bottle of soda.
[43:34] Oh, a two-liter bottle, yeah. I thought you were talking like the 20 ounce. Oh, I have a small one now, yeah. Oh, okay. Oh, yeah, but then you just transfer that. I need to get bigger or something like that. Yeah. I mean, it's going to take forever to go through all that. Yeah. I have no idea where mine came from it's a baby food jar i don't have any kids how did i get a baby foot jar interesting yeah you have a glass bottle yeah glass is like perfect
[43:55] you could when you're done with it you seal it up throw it in the garbage and to the landfill for the next three thousand years it'd be fine exactly that's what they're for so yeah exacto safety technique and organization that's really the two exactly take nice i see what you did there that's great yeah so the next one that sort of my mind went to is my Dremel tool. I've injured myself several different ways with my Dremel tool. I don't know about you guys, but it's probably
[44:34] the safest power tool in my house. Really? Yeah, I would agree with Dave. I've never hurt myself. I've injured my wife with it, but well, I mean, I've done… Was that on purpose, though? Oh. No. Oh oh that was not no we use it to dremel the dog's toenails oh okay that makes sense yeah see they're injuring the dog then yeah so it's actually there's less blood involved when i do that versus trying to use
[44:58] the guillotine because he always jerks whenever you as soon as you go to squeeze the lever oh yeah he jerks yep so the Dremel, it's really, really hard to cut them too short because they get too hot and you'll yank his foot away. Anyway, she was helping hold his foot and she bent over and it popped up off his toenail and it came up and it whacked her in the forehead, which is really not a problem. She was really close. Yeah. Well, it grabbed She was really close. Yeah.
[45:26] Well, it grabbed her hair. Oh. Oh. Yeah. And then in the course of grabbing her hair, it forced the bit into her forehead. Wow. See, that's a problem I don't have. Yeah. Yeah. You don't have to deal with that. I don't have to worry about hair. No. Well, eyebrows. That's true. I guess they are long enough to get caught in a drum. Don't look at me like that. They're very full and luscious. Luscious? I would call them a lot of things, but luscious is not one of them. Not exactly Eugene Levy.
[45:55] Yeah, well. Really? Clothes? I think so. I don't think they're that close. Really? I mean, they're not connected anymore. No. You just shaved them, they're not connected anymore. No. You just shaved them. Anyway. Yeah, moving on. So, yeah, I've drilled my hand with my Dremel numerous times. I don't use mine to drill. That's probably where I'm saving myself. Oh, yeah. I use mine for the smaller, like, for example, like just the other night,
[46:23] drilling holes for the servos and the servo rails. Yeah, I got my finger with the number, whatever that was, a 40, not a 40. It was probably a 50-something. Really? Yeah, I've got my little Black & Decker six-volt drill. Yeah, because, I'm reaching through and grabbing it, and even though I'm careful, yeah, from the back, and the drill bit goes all the way through, and bam, there's my finger. Oh, dang, that hurt. Blood, sweat, and tears. Actually, no blood this time. Oh.
[46:47] Yeah, it must have hit the callus. Cauterized it. Yeah. But yeah, so be mindful if you're using your Dremel to drill holes like me. Just be mindful of where that drill bit is going to exit the back of the piece so your finger's not in the way. Now, why do you use your Dremel for holes as opposed to a drill? The Dremel for me, like my cordless drill, it's a big 18-volt DeWalt, which I use a lot, like for modeling. But it's just too kind of big and unwieldy to drill tiny little
[47:19] servo screw holes. So my Dremel's nice and lightweight. I can move it around easy. I can get into tighter spaces with it. That's why. It's just convenient. I like, the one thing I don't like about the Dremel is that you don't get the fine motor control that you do with the drill. Yeah, my drill, that's the big difference is I've got a high speed setting on my little drill, but I've also got a low speed setting. Yeah, me too.
[47:42] And you can control it so much better. When you're trying to push through, I think you can feel more. You can get a better feel for it when you're doing it. Or a pin vice. And that's the other extreme. Yeah, that's ultra slow. And did I mention I'm always in a hurry? Oh, that's true. Yeah. But the speed doesn't bother me so much because I'm only ever really drilling wood pieces with it. Like if I'm going to go drill a hole in something aluminum,
[48:10] I'll grab the DeWalt no matter what size the hole is going to be. Yeah. Because then, yes, I need the control because if you're drilling in aluminum, speed matters. But for light ply and balsa, it can go wide open as far as I'm concerned. And I'm not even worried about heat or anything like that. To me, it's just the control. I feel like I have better control if I'm pulling that trigger and can, I don't know why, maybe I'm just weird, but I like to have
[48:33] that control to stop it when I want to stop it. See, I like to not have my finger on the trigger. With the Dremel, I can turn it on and then I can use the rest of my fingers to control the angle of the Dremel so I know that I'm drilling a hole straight okay so i guess two schools of thought yeah but anyway if you're gonna and this applies to using your dewalt also just don't put your finger don't put your finger in the way
[48:56] dummy i'm talking to me i i knew that and secure your pieces that you're drilling because i don't know how many have broken loose and whacked me in the fingers. Yes. It's usually that sharp edge of the brass that catches me. Yep. Yep. And, yeah, that's exactly, I was looking at my notes, that's exactly where I was going next. Use clamps to clamp your work. Don't use your fingers as clamps. Because, and I've done this too, using my fingers as clamps, exactly what Dave said,
[49:26] the piece lets go and comes right around and whack right on the clamp that was my finger. Whereas if I'd have been using a clamp, probably number one, wouldn't have broke loose. And if it did, it would have just hit the clamp and no harm, no foul, reclamp it and press on. So holding like a piece of brass on a piece of wood, trying to drill a hole in it, or what are we talking about? Yes. Okay. That or drill a hole in it, or what are we talking about? Yes. Okay.
[49:45] That or drilling a hole in… So when you drill a hole in a piece of wood, you really ought to have some sort of a backer. So when the drill bit goes through the other side, it makes a clean exit instead of splintering, like if there was nothing back there. Holding all of that together with your fingers, not always a great idea because the drill bit can grab that top piece and then spin and into your fingers and ouch and cuss words and
[50:12] done for the night and delayed progress you get the idea not only are you cut you're bruised yeah so that's twice as bad exactly yep or battered and broken or another instance where you should use a clamping device and not your fingers another good example is wheel axles they're not always exactly the length you need them sometimes you need to cut them shorter so they fit inside a wheel pant or whatever you get the cut off wheel attachment chuck that in the dremel and then
[50:43] grab that wheel axle and start cutting. It gets hot. Yes. It gets hot pretty quickly, actually. Okay. Now I've done this. Yeah. So use your vice if you have one. If you don't have a vice, a piece of vice grip or a pair of vice grips. If you don't have a pair of vice grips, a pair of vice grips. Something besides your fingers because that piece is going to get really hot really fast and then you won't be able to pull
[51:05] away fast enough and if it gets if it happens really fast and you lose your grip then your saw grabs that piece and then flings it into your face i always had the cutoff part fall into my lap well that's yeah nylon pants are not your friends yep another another point i was going to make yeah make sure that that piece that you're cutting off, especially in this case, a piece of music wire, make sure that's not going to land
[51:30] on your lap or your foot. I'm really careful as it falls into the trash can because I'm worried about it smoldering. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It'll sit there for hours,. I try, and it doesn't always work, but I have a big 12 inch by 12 inch piece of floor tile like tile tile ceramic tile that i i use this thing for lots of purposes i charge batteries on it i use it for a lot of stuff i try to make sure my wire pieces fall on that because i know that's not
[52:00] gonna catch on fire or anything but doesn't always work because they roll or whatever but that's a tip i picked up from you and i have my own now yeah i mean the same thing yeah the number of uses for that piece of tile or i mean lots of pieces yeah yep solder over it so exactly that kind of stuff yeah got a cracked plate what a cracked plate yeah i have a plate that's cracked
[52:20] oh how'd you crack it i don't know that's my wife what kind of plate like like a ceramic plate it's cracked. -oh. How'd you crack it? I don't know. That's my wife. What kind of plate? Like a ceramic plate? It's a ceramic plate, yeah. So I just use that instead of a tile. Do you need a tile? I think I still have no tile. It holds my iron really nice. Oh, it would. You slip it upside down and it's got the little
[52:35] foot at the bottom. Yeah. And so you can put your iron on there and it doesn't slide off the foot. Yeah. And that's another use that I use my tile for. I set my iron on it without the foot. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And that's another use that I use my tile for. I set my iron on it. Without the stand. I set the iron right on it. Oh yeah, you're not going to hurt it? Nope. So, anyway. Yeah, Dremel safety. Just be mindful of where your hand is at when you're using that thing. Sanding drum, drill bits,
[53:02] cut off wheels. Don't exceed the speed on your tools. Yeah, that's a good point. Sanding drums on your tools. Yeah, that's a good point. Sanding drums will fly apart. Yeah, that's a good point. Rarely do I ever use… Especially the cheap ones. Yeah. So my Dremel is the variable speed one, right? And even at low speed, it's probably turning 10,000 RPM. I was going to say, mine starts at 5. Okay. But it's digital, so… Okay. So if yours isn't digital it's probably eight to ten
[53:26] yeah and i'll be honest i rarely run that thing up to full throttle because to be honest it scares me i don't think i've ever had enough to full throttle like you put any any bit in that and you turn that like i'm guessing it's probably 25 30 000 rpm i mean it's up there anything spinning that fast is to me kind of scary yeah probably those small ball mills or something is the only thing that's good for like even then
[53:52] yeah like i i rarely turn mine up past about halfway like anything above that is crazy fast about 12 is about most i crack 12 12 000 yeah so anyway exactly or i'm sorry dremel safety 12,000. Yeah. So, anyway. Exacto, or, sorry. Dremel safety. Not to be taken lightly. Speaking of dremels, something that is also a good idea, I meant to mention this earlier, eye protection. Yeah. Like, especially in the shot, like, I wear glasses. Now, they're not OSHA approved,.
[54:23] They don't have a side frame. The ANSI Z87, whatever they are. They don't, exactly, we don't have a side frame the and size z87 whatever they are they don't exactly they don't have the side whatever but i'll be honest like more stuff has bounced off the the front of my glasses i got a nick out of mine right now yeah then then i mean if my glasses had not been on that would have been direct a direct shot to my eyeball yeah so even though like i glasses, so that's
[54:46] kind of my… But if you don't wear glasses, go do yourself a favor, especially if you work in the shop a lot, especially with Dremels and things like that that can send stuff flying through the air. Get yourself a pair of comfortable safety glasses. And I say comfortable because if they're not comfortable, you won't want to wear them and that's when you're going to be looking down in your ca bottle when you're trying
[55:09] to snip the end of it off because it's clogged that it decides to squirt you in the face is when you're not going to be wearing them yeah so if you have a pair that are comfortable then you will wear them and you'll get the protection that they offer see that's what as i get older i don't wear my glasses as much for up close work and i have noticed that that i and i never thought about getting about getting safety
[55:34] glasses but i need to because i've snipped ends off of a battery before yeah and it's hit me in the cheek and i'm like oh that wasn't my eyeball. Yeah. Yeah. And let me tell you, like, from firsthand experience, I know what CA in your eye feels like. And it is not a comfortable thing. Can't imagine. To go through. Glue my lips together. Don't take the caps off with your mouth. I'm sorry. That's funny. That is funny.
[56:03] I've got glued multiple fingers together or fingers to other hand or whatever. I don't think I've ever glued my lips together. That's a new one. Have you ever glued your hand to the countertop and then not realize it and then tried to walk away? No. I've done that. I mean, I've glued my hand to my airplane before. I mean, I think we've all probably done that, right?
[56:23] Yeah, holding on to it, letting it dry, and then you're like, oh oh if i don't have an airplane with dna in it there's a problem yeah right glued your lips together that's a new one yeah don't yeah i'm guilty of that i'm surprised i haven't glued my lips like i i've removed the cap with my teeth many times. That's funny. And I've also, the worst chemical burn I got segwaying into chemicals. I had thin CA run down my arm and get underneath my watch. Oh, ouch. Instantaneously went off.
[56:54] I got blisters. Oh, yeah. Third degree burns. Yeah. Or second degree at least. Yeah, get a good second out of it and you can't get the watch off. Because of the moisture. It's burning. Oh, I can't get to it because I can't get my watch off yeah that would not be cool either because it glued the latch shut oh man yeah but before we get to chemicals so enough about the dremel i would say and eye protection like just do it
[57:19] like i was going to mention i wear so i don't have to take my glasses off anymore i have bifocals they're no line but they're bifocals so i can see up close when i do this oh that's me next yes what i gotta do yep so that way you don't have to i don't want to do bifocals i know i listen i resisted i mean that's what i thought yeah you don't see them i mean, you can't tell. That's the point. Yeah, but you guys are old. He's not wrong. You like that today, Dave, don't you?
[57:52] Playing the drums. So I don't, yeah, I don't have to take my glasses off anymore to see too much. So they're always on. So get yourself a pair of safety glasses that are comfortable to wear. That way you wear them. And Ron is experimenting with Dave's bifocals and he looks funny. I wish you guys could see this. Actually, that's… Nice, right? It's not bad, is it? No. Hey, listen, man. It's just part of being experienced. There, that's a better way to put it. Yeah. of being experienced.
[58:23] There, that's a better way to put it, yeah. Okay, so next is, and these are in no real order. It was just as they popped into my head, and when things pop into my head, it's because of some stupid thing that I've done recently. Prop or no prop. And this really mostly, well, pretty much exclusively applies to electric airplanes. And this really mostly, well, pretty much exclusively applies to electric airplanes.
[58:57] Like when you're doing your setup in your shop, especially on an electric plane that's either new to you or you're programming it for the first time, just take the prop off. It's so simple. There's no chance that it could bite you. Don't even have the prop on it when you're doing your setup stuff. Because, I mean, just if you scroll through Facebook or some of these other, like Instagram, I don't have Instagram, but I've
[59:11] heard of people say, oh yeah, I saw that on Instagram. People who have been doing their setup on their electric plane with the prop on, only to have the thing come on unexpectedly and then either get them in the hand or on the leg or heaven forbid somewhere on the face because they're close to it or whatever just just take the prop or just generally damage your shop yeah right electric doesn't stop no if you have a gasoline
[59:38] engine or a nitro engine that you're running and it hits something usually that's enough to stop it electric's going to keep going yeah bite you and bite you and bite you and a lot of times they're sharper exactly exactly what i was just getting ready to say sorry then no no go right under but electric propellers are lighter thinner so they're sharper and they spin very fast very fast very fast very quickly
[1:00:02] is what i was trying to say they get to speed quickly yeah yeah and they are capable of doing lots of damage lots of pictures on the internet if you want to go and look at it i don't it's gross yes i mean our friend reggie he had the the incident not due to a setup issue just simply because he's too stupid of the issue well i shouldn't say things happen yeah happen. Yeah. It was an accident. It was a mistake he made.
[1:00:27] But electric airplanes in the shop, tinkering, just take the prop off. There's no reason to have it on, honestly. What are you talking about with him? Are you talking about the electric to the pants? Or are you talking about… No, I'm talking about the big S-Bach that almost took his hand off. I thought you were talking about the time he had the electric airplane that did what we're talking about and no that was absolutely what we're
[1:00:48] talking about a setup issue cut through his jeans yeah luckily it didn't like sever his big whatever that big arteries and then the tomorrow yeah that one the from tomorrow that one yeah i can't pronounce it for some reason but yeah airplanes, tinkering in the shop, just take the prop off. I've had multiple ducted fans eat stuff on my desk. Yeah, ducted fans. So I can give a little bit of a pass to duct, because number one, they're a pain in the butt to remove the rotor. Yeah.
[1:01:17] Most of them. And number two, if it comes on unexpectedly, worst case scenario, it's going to pick up something on your workbench and throw it at you. Both of mine have shut themselves off because they ate their power wires. Wow. Okay. But didn't really hurt you in any way. No, not at all. Right. I mean, we want to, yeah, we want to avoid injuring our airplanes, but mostly this is about you keep looking at your jet. That's funny. I really can't see anything that far away.
[1:01:42] Well, you wouldn't need to borrow Dave's guy. I might. But yeah, I mean, that's really all I wanted anything that far away. Well, you wouldn't need to borrow Dave's car. I might. But yeah, I mean, that's really all I wanted to say about that. If you've got an electric airplane that you're tinkering with in the shop, just take the prop off. Put the prop on it when you're ready to go fly it. And it takes so little time to pull a prop. I mean, I just don't…
[1:02:04] I don't understand why you wouldn't. Yeah. And I said personal experience, like I've not done that, but we know. I will admit I have. Oh, you've ran into your. I've had, well, no, not hit me. Oh. I've not hit myself, but I've had a motor come on. Unexpectedly. Yeah. It's scary. Well, and that was when I figured out, so long story short, I don't want to get into it too much, but when I was setting up that Cree Cree, cry, cry, I, one of these days I need to know how to say that.
[1:02:32] I'm just going to call it a cricket, but that makes me think of the cutter. Oh, the vinyl cutter. The vinyl cutter. Yeah, I know we have one. Yes. That's why I said that you guys have, but anyway, so with the dual motor setup on it, I didn't realize that the throttle cutoff does not work if you don't actually set both channels up as throttle. So I had throttle cut on, and I just went up on throttle a little bit.
[1:02:58] One of them turned off, and then the other one came on when I wasn't expecting it. And you had the prop on it? I had the prop on it. Surprise! Yeah. It almost sucked the curtains into it. That would have been bad. That probably would have damaged the airplane at a minimum. I would think so. Pull the motor off the mount, probably. Could have. But luckily. Just take the props off, Ron. Well, now I know. Thank you for telling me. Yeah. Gloves. How do you feel about gloves?
[1:03:30] Personal preference? Yeah. To keep me warm or to keep me safe? In the shop. I don't want gloves in the shop. Dave? I usually don't wear them. I don't like wearing them. However, there are certain things I'm doing. If I'm laying up epoxy fiberglass or whatever yes i will definitely because they're way easier to clean up than my hands so convenience okay i was gonna say what kind of gloves too when you say gloves i think like leather gloves but i guess okay after
[1:03:55] hearing him i guess i should specify trial or latex so i keep a pair of heavy duty like mechanic type gloves in my flight box for because i i'm a fan of starting engines by hand so that's to protect my hands at the field i'm talking about in the shop do you keep two or one i don't think i've ever seen you have two gloves at the field they're both yeah i have a pair i only ever use the right one okay i have no idea where my left
[1:04:21] glove is yeah but i know where it's in and it it's like new, my left one, because I am right-handed. Yeah. So it does go. But no, they are a pair. Okay. It goes, yeah, they both, yeah, why do I carry the left one around? Just in case you need a pull spark plug or something. Who knows? Oh, well, yeah, I guess maybe. Strange. It's a strange observation, but yeah, I do have the left one. It's in the flight box right there with the right one. You only had one.
[1:04:47] Well, you have to buy them in pairs, so I guess I just figured, well, they're matched. I may as well carry them around. Yeah, it's just the weight. But in the shop, I have taken to using nitro gloves lately for like handling chemicals or mixing epoxy or anytime I'm going to be like messing with something that is potentially hazardous to your health, like alcohol, like it dries your hands out and then it opens your hands up to infection.
[1:05:19] Like I read about all this stuff later, but I've never thought about. Yeah. all this stuff later but i was gonna say really because i've never thought about yeah well the oils on your hand are a natural barrier to like some certain types of bacteria so that when you take the oil off of your hands with alcohol or other chemicals then you lose that protection
[1:05:37] and if you get a cut and it gets infected quick or more quickly and so lately I've been using nitrile gloves whenever I am using the alcohol to clean stuff. Or acetone is really bad about drying out your skin and probably introducing chemicals that cause cancer and all this sort of stuff. And the reason I've done it lately is because, I don't know, I may have mentioned it before on the show, but I don't really have any feeling
[1:06:01] left in the fingertips, especially the first three fingers of each hand, like out here on the tip. Oh, like your flying fingers. That's great. Right. Well, I fly with my thumbs, and I still have feeling on those. Okay. But I have a feeling that it's probably from all the years of exposure to chemicals, because I didn't wear gloves, or burning them with the soldering iron, or poking them with the X-Acto or whatever. There's a lot of damage over the years. Yeah.
[1:06:28] So I figure if younger folks are listening to us, my piece of advice would be to start wearing gloves now and wearing eye protection now, getting in those habits so that you can protect those valuable assets as you get older. Transdermal absorption. You'll suck a lot of chemicals into your body through your skin. That's such big words. Yeah. I'm glad he can pronounce it. Transdermal absorption. So that's trans, so under. Trans is through. Under, skin. Derm, skin. Yeah, dermal is skin.
[1:07:00] N-A-L is a modifier. Skin absorption. Okay. Yeah. Never thought about it. Honestly, Yeah. Never thought about it. Honestly, never, ever thought about it. Yeah. So a lot of the stuff we handle is very, has been proven by. California. By some poor rat in a lab somewhere. Everything in California will cause cancer. It's probably where all the labs are, where they're allowed to put animals through that sort of testing. But anyway, if you get in the habit of doing it
[1:07:26] early in your hobby career, it becomes a habit that you do all the time, and therefore, you won't end up at 50 years old with no feeling left in your fingertips. 50. Well, 53. Somebody's rounding down. Yes, I did. I rounded down. I joke. But speaking of things you should get in the habit of, something else that is insidious is hearing loss. What? Exactly. It sneaks up on you without you even realizing it's happening.
[1:07:59] Yeah. As a career Air Force crew chief guy exposed to high levels of noise pretty much my whole career, and a sheet metal guy with the riveting hammers and all that sort of stuff, I have hearing loss. I mean, like Lori will tell you, I can't hear. Is it selective hearing loss? Well, that's what she used to say, but I think my hearing loss goes beyond. And it's because I didn't protect my ears. Yeah. So in the shop, lots of things we do create noise, like a lot of noise.
[1:08:36] we talked about the Dremel with a cutoff wheel and sanding drums on fiberglass cowls and wheel pants. I mean, the amount of noise that generates is significant yeah granted it's for short periods of time it is but it's all cumulative exactly it is and that's exactly right it one exposure you don't think that's such a big deal but you do 20 exposures in the course of a week or whatever, that it's cumulative. They each do damage,
[1:09:06] and then that damage compounds, kind of like interest, the more you expose your hearing to it. So Tommy's advice, find some earplugs that are comfortable to wear so that you wear them. What I've started using when I know I'm going to be making lots of noise, like grinding on a fiberglass cowl the other night, I bought a pair of molded, they're not the little foamies, and this is me rolling my fingers like you roll the foamies to get in your ears, but these are like a molded plastic.
[1:09:34] They look like an upside-down Christmas tree, kind of, and I bought them at a shooting supply place, but you can get them at hardware stores. I think you can get these things, but if you find a pair that's comfortable to wear, you will wear them and protect your hearing and not end up a half-deaf 50-year-old. I'll be honest. I use the earmuffs more than anything. As long as you're using something. Yeah.
[1:09:57] Just because the ones you were talking about, the little plasticky-looking thing, I do not like those at all. Yeah. You have to find something you like. Right, exactly. I mean, I got indoctrinated with those things basic training that's what they gave us and they even gave us the cool little l-shaped tool to shove them in there with and take them out so that's what i am accustomed to and i'm they're comfortable to me but yeah
[1:10:17] anything you can do anything that decreases that decibel level when you put them on will be beneficial in the long run and if you especially if you get in the habit of doing it like sooner rather than later yeah i spend my day yelling at patients because i can't hear them and they can't hear me yeah right and then like so the final thing that i unless you guys have something else but want to talk about was so like have a proper like first aid kit and it
[1:10:47] doesn't have to be like one of these big triage things with an aed although as we get older maybe that's not such a bad idea dave but like have have at least a stash of band-aids maybe maybe some gauze and tape to get a little neosporin neosporin yep maybe some what's the stuff you want gosh dang it hydrogen peroxide yeah because our tools get really really dirty and faster you can get that crud out of the hole exactly yeah so have have
[1:11:18] some sort of plan before you actually need it about how you're going to stem the flow of blood when you, cut half a finger off because you were using the wrong technique of, because you didn't listen to what, Dave and I and Ron were telling you. So have a proper first aid kit of some, even if it's something you put together yourself, have one. Bare minimum band-aids and gauze. Yeah, exactly. And a fire extinguisher. Thank you. I've caught myself on fire twice.
[1:11:49] Oh, my. I've caught things on fire, but never myself. Yeah, I had a motor spray incident. Cleaned out an electric motor, and then it arced on me. Back in the racing days, yeah. And then those vapors, I guess, built up in the clothes. Hard to believe that, yeah, manufacturers would make this cleaner designed for electric motors that arc when you turn them on. Weird. But, yeah, that stuff is very flammable. I've never caught myself on fire, though. That's new also.
[1:12:19] I had an RC Tango flying out into the snow. Yeah. Gold pan? Yeah. Yeah. Nice. Just just you wouldn't understand ron i'm no i don't oh speaking of that completely off topic they're re-issuing in clear the yeah oh you saw it okay never mind so let's act like i have no clue you're talking about so like one of the original well the original like the seven gear 10th scale rc buggy designed for racing made by team associated
[1:12:54] way back in 70 something 78 well maybe it was like early 80s early 80s whenever they are producing again as a nostalgia kind of thing. But I guess it's not gold? I didn't see any pictures. What I've seen is there is the old gold pan, the old 7-gear gold pan with white nylon and the whole shot. What's a gold pan? The chassis pan was a stamped piece of aluminum, and then it was anodized gold. Okay. Yeah, it's just standard standard and then they've got a special edition
[1:13:25] clear version where i guess you've got i think remember right it's got the gold pan but then all the white nylon parts are clear so you can really see the gears and stuff interesting and the wheels i'm not going to buy the wheels are clear oh that's just weird yeah remember well you off topic but trevor probably would remember this because he i think he was a racer at one time way back in the day too we used to dye the parts remember that oh yeah to to customize make my car look
[1:13:56] take that white nylon and turn it rit dye man yeah yeah yellow red blue there was a lot of pink back a mix of those colors, I think. I had one that was like red on one side and yellow on the other. It was cool, man. I never liked the look myself, but… No? Yeah. It was either white or black. Yeah. Anyway, off the card subject. One more thing. Carbon fiber. Ooh, yes. That stuff's nasty. Very, very nasty. Nasty.
[1:14:24] Worse than fiberglass. Worse for you than fiberglass also. Oh, yes. That stuff's nasty. Very, very nasty. Worse than fiberglass. Worse for you than fiberglass also. Macroscopically, it's hook-shaped. It's got barbs. Yep. So once it's in there, it's hard to get out. Nice thing about it, though, if there is a nice thing, is because it's so brittle, you can crunch it up into tinier little pieces so they don't bother you as much. I learned that the hard way. Ask Reggie. Yeah.
[1:14:48] He had to go have it removed. Yeah, he had to have his removed because his was actually, like, sticking out of his skin. He found it. It kept catching on his, like, sleeves and stuff. Oh, that was from when he got himself with the… I guess so, yeah….hyperpropylate. Yeah. So… And that dust, you just don't want that stuff in your lungs. Yep. Because it's there for good.
[1:15:04] Yep. And I meant to mention that earlier, yeah. And that dust, you just don't want that stuff in your lungs. Yep. Because it's there for good. Yep. And I meant to mention that earlier, too. I've noticed as I've gotten older that I have developed a sensitivity to balsa dust. So, when I'm sanding and there's a lot of it in the air, cough, wheeze, sneeze, all these great. Me, too. So, I bought a little, just one of those little paper particulate masks and that
[1:15:26] really helps a lot so yeah if you get in the habit of using a mask when you're going to be generating a lot of dust or working with carbon fiber like dave says that would be a beneficial habit to get into yeah it's so simple and they're super cheap yeah and the one i have is actually really comfortable you can squeeze the nose so that it doesn't fog up glasses. Yeah. Yeah. They're pretty comfortable. I mean, like, it's not as comfortable as not wearing one.
[1:15:51] Well, and you're not going to wear it for four hours straight. The N95s are not actually too bad as a dust mask. I'm not actually, I don't think I've ever had one of those on. Even when COVID was going on, I don't think I ever wore one. I just kind of have an unlimited supply of those. What, N95? Mm-hmm. Really? Yeah. I always had a gaiter. My elastic gaiter that would come out of the cover.
[1:16:15] Yeah. So, but yeah, interesting. Yeah. But they don't work half bad for what we do. I don't think you want them, wear them in an industrial setting, but. Yeah. Well, they're not going to stop like chemical vapors, let's be clear. For that, you would need a proper respirator, which if you're doing any spraying, if you're spraying things like lacquer thinner, or even if you're just using them, the vapors from that stuff is pretty nasty. Crack a window and put a fan in it.
[1:16:33] Blowing out. Yes. Proper ventilation is very important. Yep. For sure. Same with, like, laser cutting and all that kind of stuff. Yeah. Yeah, because, I mean, you're burning stuff, and who knows, like, if like if you're gonna who knows what's in what you're actually burning there's carcinogens in there yeah balsa does is bad enough but if you go laser cutting i don't know foam who knows what's in that stuff or pvc pvc will give you chlorine gas that's not good no i think that's what you
[1:17:00] kill people with i think so yeah you gotta be that. I didn't know that when I first got my laser. I mean, I never cut PVC. Right. But when you start looking into things that you can and cannot cut, you kind of have to be careful. Yes. Same with, there's a, I don't know which one it is, but there's a type of clear, I don't know if it's acrylic or Lexan or which one, but you have to be careful cutting that too.
[1:17:26] I'd have to look into it again. I don't know it was i just know i don't have any well i imagine any of it's probably not good for you it's just probably varying stages of badness that's why whenever i cut like so with the it's nicely set up because that laser cutter even though it's small still creates a lot of smoke it's in its own little case, has the fan that blows it out the window. And there's, I mean, it's amazing when you stand, because the way our house is set up,
[1:17:52] I can see the window that that's blowing out of from the kitchen because it's in the garage. It's amazing how much smoke you see coming out of that when you're actually cutting. Yeah. There's a lot. Yeah. Anyway. Well, and I mean, aside from the health issue, just the stink of the stuff. Oh, yeah. It's definitely got a smell of it. Yeah. It will permeate. Especially the falcata. Like the falcata that we were using there for a while. Yep. I saw a bunch of that.
[1:18:20] That stuff, well, we're still going to use it. Yeah. That's great. But it has a smell. But yeah. And it leaves like a residue after you're cutting it too, which is odd Yeah, maybe there's like a resin in the wind or something. It could be that it could be speeds and feeds They're not right either or we don't have a powerful enough laser. I mean, that's probably what it is We just love hitting that we just need a more powerful laser. That's all there you go Hit it properly that time. Hey
[1:18:44] need a more powerful laser that's all there you go hit it properly that time so yeah that's pretty much it i was gonna say the only thing i wanted to cover really quick on safety and it won't take long is batteries when you're charging always make sure you stay with them and charge them in a battery safe lipo bag case whatever but yeah agree i mean that's just i have knock on wood never had a lipo go off on me but i've
[1:19:06] heard a lot of people that have and it doesn't seem fun yeah and that fire by the way you cannot put that fire out with like a regular fire extinguisher no the chemical makeup of whatever like i don't know the i'm not a chemist it feeds itself yes yeah it stays like self-licking ice cream cone. It will just keep going until it's gone. So the only way to put out a lipo fire is sand, right? You have to. No, there's a halon or halon or whatever. There's an extinguisher.
[1:19:40] So removing the oxygen. The oxygen that will stop it, yeah. Yeah, because it somehow or another generates its own oxygen, but if you completely isolate it, it can't do that. Yeah. I don't know enough about that. I thought that's why so many people had, like, the buckets of sand. Like, you had to put it in a bucket of sand for whatever reason. Oh, I don't know. I don't know. I just threw it like a hand grenade out in the middle of the road. And let it do its thing until it was done.
[1:20:04] I mean, if you ever want to see one of those go off like watch battle bots oh yeah i was watching that the other day and there was one hit that just took out a battery and it i could not believe how much smoke there was yeah i mean oh they smell really heavy yeah but that stinks too i can't imagine like i honestly it i will admit i probably am not as safe at charging my batteries as I should be because I will charge them upstairs on the counter.
[1:20:30] But I figure I'm by a sink, I'm by a window I can throw them out, I'm by things that might help me. You can drop them into the metal sink and they're not going to burn anything around them. There's nothing above it they'll catch. We don't have a metal sink. I at least… You least no it's that whatever
[1:20:57] i don't know what it is but the plasticky sink thing because it's that double wide sink same as ours well no ours are metal now yeah we've got the stainless ones now i gotta stay in the sink so i just yeah i i always charge mine on that ceramic plate yeah and i should probably take more precaution than just that but yeah i i mean i won't leave them alone right i will admit i will stay with them and that's the nice thing about batteries that
[1:21:18] charge a little faster too is i'm not wasting so much time waiting for all those barriers or batteries to charge that was the one thing i dislike so much time waiting for all those batteries to charge. That was the one thing I disliked so much about the old, what was it, the 4S50 200-packs I had? Two hours. By the time you actually got it to balance and all that stuff, you were right at two hours to charge it. And that's a long time for a single battery. But anyway, I digress.
[1:21:42] That's not what the point is. But battery safety. Safety in the shop. Don't leave them unattended for sure, and then have a proper place to charge them. Yep. And fire extinguishers are a good idea. Just flat-out common sense. Eh, that's a hard one. Yeah, I mean, common… I mean, this coming, by the way, from the guy that glued his lips together. Live and learn. Common sense says don't do that now. Common sense. I'm not sure that we should call it common sense anymore.
[1:22:14] Because is it common, really? I mean, maybe good sense. Maybe there's such a thing as good sense. Try and think before you do something. Yeah. Think things through. is good sense. Try and think before you do something. Yeah. Think things through. But bottom line, we want everybody to be around tomorrow to enjoy the hobby. With majority of their digits. With all of their digits, hopefully. I'm thinking that. I know. I appreciate that. I did it earlier, so I didn't want to hit him again.
[1:22:42] But yeah. It's okay. We want you all to be around to listen to the next episode that we air. So be safe in the shop. Take your time. Slow down. Don't be a Tommy. Don't be a Tommy. Yeah. He's always in a hurry. And that's just a character flaw of his. And he puts holes in his own airplane before he's ever flown. See, he had to. Yeah. But you patched it very nicely with a piece of covering that's not the same color. Believe it or not, it's UltraCode.
[1:23:10] It's all UltraCode. It just doesn't freaking match. Really? Yeah. That does not look… That's what happens when you… Yeah. Different lot numbers. Whatever. It's not even close to matching. Yeah, those grays I got for the… whatever it was. They didn't match because i ordered three rolls to start with and it was still short was that the value hobby stuff though yeah well it was not even value hobby it was joe joe's joe's covering shop amazon special actually no
[1:23:40] it wasn't even amazon it was ebay oh Oh, boy. Amazon heat shrink covering by Joe. That's what it was. Stay away from Joe's covering, folks. Sold on eBay. Yeah, they weren't even close. Yeah. All right. So that's all I got. I just wanted to hit the safety thing. Be careful, everybody. I don't think we've covered safety. I don't remember if we have. Yeah. But if we haven't, never a bad time to go over it again, to put it fresh in everybody's mind. Good deal.
[1:24:13] Are we going to do a wives episode? We should probably think about that. That's probably actually next, isn't it? I think so, because it's usually around the first of January. Usually it's our first podcast of January, isn't it? First podcast of the year? I thought it was the last. Oh, is it the last? Either way. So, today's the 14th, because we're recording on a Thursday. That means tomorrow is when this releases the 5th. Yeah, so that's… Next episode.
[1:24:39] Next episode will be the YF episode, as long as they want to do it. I guess we need to talk to them about it. But we'll figure that out and plan. It's always fun listening to them bash us. I don't know. We'll see. I mean, it's fun for our listeners, I mean. Oh, I don't know. I'm going to try and get Crystal to say she's proud of me for buying a jet. I don't know if that'll work. We'll see. You are not going to get Crystal to say she's proud of you for buying a jet. I've seen the looks.
[1:25:06] Yeah. If anything, you might get her to say she's happy for you that you got a jet. You may have to settle for that. I'm going to try for proud, but we'll see. I know. This will be interesting. It's a tall… Better bet I have. Tall worker. Real good Christmas present for her. Right. I'm not buying her anything. Anyway. So much for that idea. So much for that idea. So much for that idea. We don't do presents between each other. There's no need to. That's what she tells you.
[1:25:32] We never have. We're not that kind of couple. Okay. Last thing I want to say. Yes. Turn your soldering irons off. Yeah. If you're in the shop working right now, listening to us babble on about safety. If you're finished with it. If you're in the shop working right now listening to us babble on about safety if you're finished with if you're finished with it turn it off your soldering iron mine hasn't my new one has an auto shut off nice actually it's not a shut off it goes into sleep
[1:25:56] mode and then if you jiggle it it just turns itself back on oh that's fine i love that turns itself off or at least down yeah yeah it. It takes itself down to the very lowest setting, which is like 150 degrees. Yeah, you can't hardly even burn yourself with that. Interesting. Like I said, I remember I've walked back in Hobbyside. Oh, yeah, all three of us have done it. Yes. Three weeks in the garage. That's the record. So we don't want anyone out there trying to beat that.
[1:26:27] I've never left a covering iron on, though. Have you? No. I always unplug it. Me too. Well, and maybe that's the difference. I actually unplug those, whereas a soldering iron stays plugged in. No, I unplug my soldering iron too, but I have left it on overnight before. Oh. Just once. And it scared the bejesus out of me because i got up at like in like two o'clock in the morning i was like oh my god i forgot to turn
[1:26:50] the iron off well what kind of iron do you have like is it one that actually has its own little station that it knocks in yeah so it stores inside of it yeah mine was nice and safe but yeah yeah i mean the thing overheats short circuits and, and then, I mean, who knows? What falls on it? Yeah. Or, if I had a cat, the cat knocks it off. Whatever. I mean, there's lots of reasons to not leave it on. So turn your soldering iron off, you.
[1:27:21] What do you have, by the way, that turns off? What kind is it? I might want to get a new one then. I'll have to look at my… Yeah, let me know when you do that. It's some sort of weird Asian name and it's really nice. Let me know. And we can talk about it next week if we remember to. Make a note on your note. Possibly a Tool of the Week episode. Perhaps. That way we can figure out what that one is. Soldering. Okay. Okay. I'll be ready to sign off for the evening. I'm good.
[1:27:52] Well, thank you for listening. I'm sorry. You're looking at me. You're welcome. I listened not very much this time. You listened a lot. You can take it. Say goodbye. Alright, everyone. Well, thanks for listening. We're going to sign off now. I'm Tom. I'm Ron. You listened a lot. You can take it. Say goodbye. All right, everyone. Well, thanks for listening. We're going to sign off now. I'm Tom. I'm Ron. And I'm Dave. Good night. Good night. It's backwards.
[1:28:12] We hope you enjoyed this episode of the RC Plane Lab Podcast. For topic suggestions, to ask questions, or to give any feedback, connect with us at rcplanelab.com or email us direct at either ron at rcplanelab.com or tom at rcplanelab.com or email us direct at either ron at rcplanelab.com or com at rcplanelab.com. You can also text us or leave us a voicemail at 818-351-9846. Please subscribe, rate, and review us on your favorite podcast app. Until next time, may your landings be gentle.
